Just had the chance last night to listen to the recording for John Wangli's (王黎 / Ông Lê) Mandarin-English-Tagalog-Hokkien primer. A few short observations, besides the voiceperson having a beautiful voice:
1) Crisp, musical, sensual Coanciu accent.
2) No central vowel. Vowels follow Amoy pattern. Wonder if this may've actually came about on site, on the islands.
3) Tones follow Coanciu pattern. I've heard this pattern in Klang as well. The cadence also feels not quite the same. That's probably what I find so sexy about the Coanciu accent. It's probably also why I and maybe many others have a hard time understanding Coanciu Hoklo.
4) Recordings are key! Turns out I was wrong in many places as to how to interpret the bad romanizations. The first example comes to mind is Ong Le's "ma" for MEAT. In the recordings, it's clearly POJ "mah".
Nā ū lâng chùbī thiaⁿ khoàⁿ ce lio̍k'im, chiáⁿ lí kā goá kóng-cit'e. Kîsi̍t goá ahboē ū pānhoat hācài he tóng'àn, lēngji̍t cia'ko' poa' tiámsiaⁿ lâi kā chúlí hō· hósè.
Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the field
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
1. Hi, Siamiwako. Glad U stopped by to enrich this thread. Your post actually holds way more info than the Wiki article U linked to, ditto for the Mando Wiki. We'll have to add the good info in this thread to Wiki by and by.
2. In an "unrelated development", just a couple days ago something in the air must've jarred my mind and I thought to myself, Hey, what if there was a kind of Hokkien with bits of Spanish in it? Then my conscious mind said maybe such a dialect exists or once existed on the islands between Taiwan and Sulawesi. Then I read your post and go, Wow!
3. By Luzon Hoklo, I just meant the Hokkien spoken on Luzon. By Binondo Hoklo, I mean the Hokkien spoken in Binondo. I really don't know if Hoklo is spoken differently in different spots around Luzon. I do know the Hokkien spoken in Cebu ain't quite the same as the Binondo kind.
4. A couple of corrections to the Wiki, just for the record.
4a. Not all Pinoy Hokkien dialects have 7-toneme systems. In fact the Hokkien in Ong Le's recording -- I'm guessing this is Binondo Hoklo -- runs on 8 tonemes.
4b. Why the insistence that Hoklo satbûn comes from a European language, not Tagalog? Very telling, in my mind. Just a Tn̂glâng conceit that Tn̂glâng borrow nothing from hoanná. The common wisdom among linguists is that the word comes from Malay. I think it may well have been either Malay or Tagalog. I doubt most linguists ever imagined it could've come from Tagalog, but they underestimate or aren't aware of how thick ties were w/i the Banlam - Luzon - Formosa triangle.
4c. Why the assumption that Pinoy Hoklo "tse-ke", meaning CHECK (method of payment), comes from Taiwanese? I mean, there's no such word in TW Hoklo. Vs the Spanish word "cheque" (pronounced like POJ cekkè) which I think has been loaned into every Pinoy trade language. Once again, this is kind of telling: Pinoy Hoklo seem to feel this instinctive tie, or bond, to TW Hoklo--poss. in that Banlam-Luzon-Formosa way--whereas Hoklo farther west actually seem to feel no special closeness to TW Hoklo, even seeing them as "the crazy wing" of the Hoklo diaspora, whereas TW Hakka can be quite cuddly... (U guys can confirm this or debunk it.)
5. Some specific questions concerning SMWK's post.
5a.
5b. BTW is "ke kh'a" the word for PRICE? What tone is the "kh'a"? Reminds me of the Siamese word for PRICE.
5c.
5d.
5e. All the words U introduced seem to natural to Hokkien, just like most of the Malay words in Melaka Straits Hokkien.
5f. About "word mixing": point taken. To be honest, though, I have so much trouble understanding Coanciu Hoklo to begin with, and, even when I do understand it, it's in spite of a raft of "exotic" sounding vocabulary... So if I heard someone say "Si di a'be paga din, lan ceci laikhi" (IF YOU ALSO HAVEN'T PAID YET, LET'S GO OVER NOW), I probably wouldn't understand it, but I would probably think it was "pure" Hoklo.
6. Mark -- Have U been to the Phils? The use of hanji in public in the Phils (outside of Binondo) kind of reminds me of Panamá, the most "pervasively Chinese" city in the Western Hemisphere. Probably only a couple percent of Pinoys can read hanji, but hanji are everywhere in the Manila-Angeles-Tarlac, area -- sparse compared to Penang or Bangkok, but reaching far and deep. I esp. noticed this when I went back to Manila from Ilokos by bus. The presence of hanji in Ilokos is something more on the level of California or maybe Sydney.
7. Chinese-literate Pinoys are, I think, a stealthy group. Something I remember well / 印象真深: in a department store in Davao, down south, a huge chunk of the books section was Chinese-language cookbooks. It wasn't just a few titles. It was three or four shelves running for at least a meter each, maybe more. I didn't see many obvious Tsinoys when I was in Davao. I didn't hear a word of Hoklo in the air. Could it be that people were buying these books and just using the pictures? I asked the sióciá, "So many cookbooks in Chinese. Who buys these?" And she said matter-of-factly, "The Chinese people here."
8. Siamiwako is a virtuoso Chinese writer himself. He has poetry up on the web. Nā ū hèngchù ê lâng, PM him.
9. My gut feeling is that port cities like Manila, Bangkok and, most obviously, Singapore are actually "re-sinicizing" as we speak. The "black-and-white-photo era" was the height of Anglo power as well as a low point for Sino power. Even in the '80s, I think a lot of Tn̂glâng just took it for granted that there was no such thing as Sino power, besides the o·siāhoē.
10. Yelei, I mean using hanji, with their Hokkien "sound values", to transcribe non-Sino place names. This is not what I mean by "stiff", though. What's stiff, then? Well, in Modern Standard Chinese, when people use hanji with their Mandarin sound values to transcribe non-Sino place names, they actually go out of their way to use words that look and feel "foreign". Notice this is not what the Hoklo did when they got to Formosa, Luzon, etc.
11. My observation: in M'sia and pretty much all of Nusantara, Hokkien- and Teochew-based transcriptions tend not to be stiff. This goes for most place names. 古晉 霹靂 詩巫 爪哇 麻六甲 ... these are names that could just as well be given to places in Tn̂gsoaⁿ. But M'sian small businesses seem to prefer Mandarin-based transcription with stiff, i.e. "foreign-looking" hanji. Just go to the mall and check out the names of the Sino-owned hair salons. Now, I realize there's a big old grey area in between, not to mention straight-up Sino-sense names like 新山 泰京 太平 巨港 峴港 which fall outside this discussion...
12.
2. In an "unrelated development", just a couple days ago something in the air must've jarred my mind and I thought to myself, Hey, what if there was a kind of Hokkien with bits of Spanish in it? Then my conscious mind said maybe such a dialect exists or once existed on the islands between Taiwan and Sulawesi. Then I read your post and go, Wow!
3. By Luzon Hoklo, I just meant the Hokkien spoken on Luzon. By Binondo Hoklo, I mean the Hokkien spoken in Binondo. I really don't know if Hoklo is spoken differently in different spots around Luzon. I do know the Hokkien spoken in Cebu ain't quite the same as the Binondo kind.
4. A couple of corrections to the Wiki, just for the record.
4a. Not all Pinoy Hokkien dialects have 7-toneme systems. In fact the Hokkien in Ong Le's recording -- I'm guessing this is Binondo Hoklo -- runs on 8 tonemes.
4b. Why the insistence that Hoklo satbûn comes from a European language, not Tagalog? Very telling, in my mind. Just a Tn̂glâng conceit that Tn̂glâng borrow nothing from hoanná. The common wisdom among linguists is that the word comes from Malay. I think it may well have been either Malay or Tagalog. I doubt most linguists ever imagined it could've come from Tagalog, but they underestimate or aren't aware of how thick ties were w/i the Banlam - Luzon - Formosa triangle.
4c. Why the assumption that Pinoy Hoklo "tse-ke", meaning CHECK (method of payment), comes from Taiwanese? I mean, there's no such word in TW Hoklo. Vs the Spanish word "cheque" (pronounced like POJ cekkè) which I think has been loaned into every Pinoy trade language. Once again, this is kind of telling: Pinoy Hoklo seem to feel this instinctive tie, or bond, to TW Hoklo--poss. in that Banlam-Luzon-Formosa way--whereas Hoklo farther west actually seem to feel no special closeness to TW Hoklo, even seeing them as "the crazy wing" of the Hoklo diaspora, whereas TW Hakka can be quite cuddly... (U guys can confirm this or debunk it.)
5. Some specific questions concerning SMWK's post.
5a.
This must be Tagalog. No non-Pinoy dialect that I know of uses this word. It's so interesting that this word is so integrated into Pinoy Hokkien that U weren't even sure if it came from Tagalog or "Old Hokkien".Bantay* - Really (e.g. Ke kh'a bantay kui 價錢真貴)
5b. BTW is "ke kh'a" the word for PRICE? What tone is the "kh'a"? Reminds me of the Siamese word for PRICE.
5c.
What's the vowel in "beh"? What does the word rhyme with?Di wu pala beh?
5d.
What's this "t'o"? What does it rhyme with? What's the tone on it? Does it mean TO GIVE when it stands alone w/o other verbs?jiong zuai sauli t'o-i
5e. All the words U introduced seem to natural to Hokkien, just like most of the Malay words in Melaka Straits Hokkien.
5f. About "word mixing": point taken. To be honest, though, I have so much trouble understanding Coanciu Hoklo to begin with, and, even when I do understand it, it's in spite of a raft of "exotic" sounding vocabulary... So if I heard someone say "Si di a'be paga din, lan ceci laikhi" (IF YOU ALSO HAVEN'T PAID YET, LET'S GO OVER NOW), I probably wouldn't understand it, but I would probably think it was "pure" Hoklo.
6. Mark -- Have U been to the Phils? The use of hanji in public in the Phils (outside of Binondo) kind of reminds me of Panamá, the most "pervasively Chinese" city in the Western Hemisphere. Probably only a couple percent of Pinoys can read hanji, but hanji are everywhere in the Manila-Angeles-Tarlac, area -- sparse compared to Penang or Bangkok, but reaching far and deep. I esp. noticed this when I went back to Manila from Ilokos by bus. The presence of hanji in Ilokos is something more on the level of California or maybe Sydney.
7. Chinese-literate Pinoys are, I think, a stealthy group. Something I remember well / 印象真深: in a department store in Davao, down south, a huge chunk of the books section was Chinese-language cookbooks. It wasn't just a few titles. It was three or four shelves running for at least a meter each, maybe more. I didn't see many obvious Tsinoys when I was in Davao. I didn't hear a word of Hoklo in the air. Could it be that people were buying these books and just using the pictures? I asked the sióciá, "So many cookbooks in Chinese. Who buys these?" And she said matter-of-factly, "The Chinese people here."
8. Siamiwako is a virtuoso Chinese writer himself. He has poetry up on the web. Nā ū hèngchù ê lâng, PM him.
9. My gut feeling is that port cities like Manila, Bangkok and, most obviously, Singapore are actually "re-sinicizing" as we speak. The "black-and-white-photo era" was the height of Anglo power as well as a low point for Sino power. Even in the '80s, I think a lot of Tn̂glâng just took it for granted that there was no such thing as Sino power, besides the o·siāhoē.
10. Yelei, I mean using hanji, with their Hokkien "sound values", to transcribe non-Sino place names. This is not what I mean by "stiff", though. What's stiff, then? Well, in Modern Standard Chinese, when people use hanji with their Mandarin sound values to transcribe non-Sino place names, they actually go out of their way to use words that look and feel "foreign". Notice this is not what the Hoklo did when they got to Formosa, Luzon, etc.
11. My observation: in M'sia and pretty much all of Nusantara, Hokkien- and Teochew-based transcriptions tend not to be stiff. This goes for most place names. 古晉 霹靂 詩巫 爪哇 麻六甲 ... these are names that could just as well be given to places in Tn̂gsoaⁿ. But M'sian small businesses seem to prefer Mandarin-based transcription with stiff, i.e. "foreign-looking" hanji. Just go to the mall and check out the names of the Sino-owned hair salons. Now, I realize there's a big old grey area in between, not to mention straight-up Sino-sense names like 新山 泰京 太平 巨港 峴港 which fall outside this discussion...
12.
Widespread in TW. I associate it with the piedmont and plains zones that skew Ciangciu. Young people from those areas seem to've toned it down compared to their parents' generation. Just my impression.Aha! Another example of the elided -i- in syllables with -iong, just like Khí-hiông 起雄, which becomes khí-hông in Penang. I wonder if there are any more examples?
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
I doubt it is from Tagalog. Tagalog probably has it from Spanish. This is what the Oxford English Dictionary has to say about the etymology of "soap"Why the insistence that Hoklo satbûn comes from a European language, not Tagalog? Very telling, in my mind. Just a Tn̂glâng conceit that Tn̂glâng borrow nothing from hoanná. The common wisdom among linguists is that the word comes from Malay.
A word widely represented in the European languages. Within the Germanic group the forms are Old English sápe, Old Frisian type *sêpe (West Frisian sjippe, East Frisian sêpe, North Frisian sîp), Middle Dutch seepe (Dutch zeep), Middle Low German and Low German sêpe (hence Danish sæbe), Old High German seifa, seipha (Middle High German seiffe, saiffe, etc., German seife); the Old Norse and Icelandic sápa (Norwegian saapa, Swedish såpa) is apparently < Old English. The early Germanic *saipōn- is the source on the one hand of Finnish saip(p)io, saip(p)ua, Lapp saipo, and on the other of Latin sāpo (first mentioned by Pliny), whence Italian sapone, French savon, Spanish jabon, Portuguese sabão, Romanian sapun, sapon, etc. Whether the word is of purely Germanic origin is doubtful; its occurrence in some of the Tartar languages may indicate that it was introduced by early trade from the East.
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
Interesting how old the word is!
What I mean is that the word probably didn't move from (most likely) Portuguese into Hoklo directly, but rather via Malay or Tagalog. Malay does seem more likely from what I know. The fact that the word has a similar contour in Malay, Tagalog, Hoklo, etc., also seems to suggest that it was borrowed from (most likely) Portuguese into a Nusantara trade language, and eventually from there to the backwaters of many a SEA province. It doesn't seem likely that that trade language would've been Hokkien. Most likely it was "hoanna before Hoklo".
What I mean is that the word probably didn't move from (most likely) Portuguese into Hoklo directly, but rather via Malay or Tagalog. Malay does seem more likely from what I know. The fact that the word has a similar contour in Malay, Tagalog, Hoklo, etc., also seems to suggest that it was borrowed from (most likely) Portuguese into a Nusantara trade language, and eventually from there to the backwaters of many a SEA province. It doesn't seem likely that that trade language would've been Hokkien. Most likely it was "hoanna before Hoklo".
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
若有共我講过欲愛听看王黎仒録音档案仒人，ca 昏有接着一仒連結 ·無？
Here is my phonological analysis of the tonemes in the Philippine Hoklo found in the file. I use a three-level tone scale since that is what exists in this dialect (and most Hoklo dialects I know) on a phonological level. Tip of the hat to the Coảnciu jịtián on the UCLA website. Couldn't've made such fast work of T6-T7 w/o it.
T1 阴平 22-22（running - citation）
T2 阴上 23-33
T3 阴去 33-31
T4 阴入 3-3（inc. with glottal stop final）
T5 阳平 11-23
T6 阳上 11-22
T7 阳去 11-31
T8 阳入 1-23（inc. w/ glottal stop final）
Some observations:
1) The 11 and 22 running tones--excluding T6 阳上--seem subject to a system of "tone sandhi". E.g. T1 seems to go to 11 when followed by citation T2. ... T5 and T7 seem to go to 22 when followed by a syllable with the contour 22. Generally, this dialect seems to be averse to having a low-level contour and a mid-level contour in adjacent syllables! Họkbụseng 服務生 becomes mid-level, mid-level, mid-level. Not sure if this is a Coanciu thing or a Luzon thing.
2) Atonal syllables "suffixed" to the end of a sandhi group seem to do strange things, at least the first such syllable. For example the question particle 無 takes a high-falling tone (!) either usually or always. The contour of the citation syllable in the group may have a bearing.
3) All final stops, most notably the glottal stop, stay true to themselves at any position, whether running, citation, or suffixed.
4) The 阴 (T1 thru T4) citation tones are the same as the running tones for those tones in mainstream TW. In some places she seems to have running T2 as 33- and T3 as 31-. Not sure if I'm hearing things, or if maybe the voiceperson watches a lot of TW Hoklo TV, or if maybe the Amoy-type tone system has also been well-represented in the Phils. It wouldn't be too far-fetched for the Tng literary layer to run on one set of tone rules, and the older layers to run on another, but it seems this isn't the case.
Here is my phonological analysis of the tonemes in the Philippine Hoklo found in the file. I use a three-level tone scale since that is what exists in this dialect (and most Hoklo dialects I know) on a phonological level. Tip of the hat to the Coảnciu jịtián on the UCLA website. Couldn't've made such fast work of T6-T7 w/o it.
T1 阴平 22-22（running - citation）
T2 阴上 23-33
T3 阴去 33-31
T4 阴入 3-3（inc. with glottal stop final）
T5 阳平 11-23
T6 阳上 11-22
T7 阳去 11-31
T8 阳入 1-23（inc. w/ glottal stop final）
Some observations:
1) The 11 and 22 running tones--excluding T6 阳上--seem subject to a system of "tone sandhi". E.g. T1 seems to go to 11 when followed by citation T2. ... T5 and T7 seem to go to 22 when followed by a syllable with the contour 22. Generally, this dialect seems to be averse to having a low-level contour and a mid-level contour in adjacent syllables! Họkbụseng 服務生 becomes mid-level, mid-level, mid-level. Not sure if this is a Coanciu thing or a Luzon thing.
2) Atonal syllables "suffixed" to the end of a sandhi group seem to do strange things, at least the first such syllable. For example the question particle 無 takes a high-falling tone (!) either usually or always. The contour of the citation syllable in the group may have a bearing.
3) All final stops, most notably the glottal stop, stay true to themselves at any position, whether running, citation, or suffixed.
4) The 阴 (T1 thru T4) citation tones are the same as the running tones for those tones in mainstream TW. In some places she seems to have running T2 as 33- and T3 as 31-. Not sure if I'm hearing things, or if maybe the voiceperson watches a lot of TW Hoklo TV, or if maybe the Amoy-type tone system has also been well-represented in the Phils. It wouldn't be too far-fetched for the Tng literary layer to run on one set of tone rules, and the older layers to run on another, but it seems this isn't the case.
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
Sorry about the misunderstanding! Two of most argued over words in Hokkien are sat-bun and lui, and some people have said some crazy things about them in the past (no-one who posts now, though, I think), so I thought I'd go and use the OED for sat-bun.What I mean is that the word probably didn't move from (most likely) Portuguese into Hoklo directly, but rather via Malay or Tagalog.
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
amhoanna wrote: 2. In an "unrelated development", just a couple days ago something in the air must've jarred my mind and I thought to myself, Hey, what if there was a kind of Hokkien with bits of Spanish in it? Then my conscious mind said maybe such a dialect exists or once existed on the islands between Taiwan and Sulawesi. Then I read your post and go, Wow!
Agree, they borrow Visayan words into their vocabulary. This makes Lan-nang-oe more regional than it is.amhoanna wrote: 3. By Luzon Hoklo, I just meant the Hokkien spoken on Luzon. By Binondo Hoklo, I mean the Hokkien spoken in Binondo. I really don't know if Hoklo is spoken differently in different spots around Luzon. I do know the Hokkien spoken in Cebu ain't quite the same as the Binondo kind.
I don't know either. I usually say "sa-bon" when I speak hokkien.amhoanna wrote: 4b. Why the insistence that Hoklo satbûn comes from a European language, not Tagalog? Very telling, in my mind. Just a Tn̂glâng conceit that Tn̂glâng borrow nothing from hoanná. The common wisdom among linguists is that the word comes from Malay. I think it may well have been either Malay or Tagalog. I doubt most linguists ever imagined it could've come from Tagalog, but they underestimate or aren't aware of how thick ties were w/i the Banlam - Luzon - Formosa triangle.
My feeling is that it's a Tagalog loan word from Spanish. Some local Chinese will say k'ui-p'io 開(支)票 as oppose to "k'ui tse-ke".amhoanna wrote: 4c. Why the assumption that Pinoy Hoklo "tse-ke", meaning CHECK (method of payment), comes from Taiwanese? I mean, there's no such word in TW Hoklo. Vs the Spanish word "cheque" (pronounced like POJ cekkè) which I think has been loaned into every Pinoy trade language.
Bantay actually means "watch" in Tagalog. My gut feel is that this is loan or derived from Tagalog. However, someone told me that it's Hokkien. I had thought about this and guessed if it could be "萬態" to mean something strong (superlative)? To be honest, I never heard of this word except in metro manila!amhoanna wrote: 5a.This must be Tagalog. No non-Pinoy dialect that I know of uses this word. It's so interesting that this word is so integrated into Pinoy Hokkien that U weren't even sure if it came from Tagalog or "Old Hokkien".Bantay* - Really (e.g. Ke kh'a bantay kui 價錢真貴)
kh'a = 腳 as in 腳骨，腳退 soundingamhoanna wrote: 5b. BTW is "ke kh'a" the word for PRICE? What tone is the "kh'a"? Reminds me of the Siamese word for PRICE.
beh = 未 as in 你睏未，未吃 soundingamhoanna wrote: 5c.What's the vowel in "beh"? What does the word rhyme with?Di wu pala beh?
t'o = 吐 as 吐血 sounding - very likely 討 as in 討錢，討我 (???)amhoanna wrote: 5d.What's this "t'o"? What does it rhyme with? What's the tone on it? Does it mean TO GIVE when it stands alone w/o other verbs?jiong zuai sauli t'o-i
This definitely sounds like a ZC person who went to metro manila and influenced by Tagalog hence the use of "Si"... followed by "din"! You sound like a Tsinoy!!!amhoanna wrote: "Si di a'be paga din, lan ceci laikhi" (IF YOU ALSO HAVEN'T PAID YET, LET'S GO OVER NOW)
I believe Tsinoys born prior to 60's and have been sent to local Chinese schools should have better reading and writing skills than later generations.amhoanna wrote: 7. Chinese-literate Pinoys are, I think, a stealthy group... Who buys these?" And she said matter-of-factly, "The Chinese people here."
Last edited by siamiwako on Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:57 pm, edited 8 times in total.
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
In recent years, local Chinese schools are encouraging everyone to speak Mandarin, however the adoption, I believe, will have a slower rate compared to Malaysia and Singapore.Mark Yong wrote: ... the short if it is that it sounds like the Philippines is a near-perfect fossilisation of late 19th century 泉州 Coan Ciu dialect, with even the writing system having suffered minimal intrusion from the onslaught of Modern Standard Chinese (sounds like they insulated themselves even better than Malaysia!).
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
BTW has everybody who asked to hear the Ong Le files gotten a link in their email?
The UCLA Hoklo look-up has been a great resource during this Pinoy Hokkien adventure.
It feels right to talk this way!
BTW do Zamboanga Tsinoys ever hang out in random places in Zamboanga? Or are they usually in private settings? I guess this question goes for all of Phils. I wouldn't mind meeting some people that talk like this!
Also I recall Sugbo Hoklo having a Lionghai or Mainline Taiwanese kind of sound.Agree, they borrow Visayan words into their vocabulary. This makes Lan-nang-oe more regional than it is.
Very interesting situation. Is the /t/ aspirated as in Hoklo thài 態？Or unaspirated like in 代?Bantay actually means "watch" in Tagalog. My gut feel is that this is loan or derived from Tagalog. However, someone told me that it's Hokkien. I had thought about this and guessed if it could be "萬態" to mean something strong (superlative)? To be honest, I never heard of this word except in metro manila!
So kèkha for PRICE. Interesting.kh'a = 腳 as in 腳骨，腳退 sounding
Another interesting word. The UCLA Hoklo look-up also has a word tō· meaning TO GIVE, under the kanji 度.t'o = 吐 as 吐血 sounding - very likely 討 as in 討錢，討我 (???)
The UCLA Hoklo look-up has been a great resource during this Pinoy Hokkien adventure.
"Si di a'be paga din, lan ceci laikhi" (IF YOU ALSO HAVEN'T PAID YET, LET'S GO OVER NOW)
This definitely sounds like a ZC person who went to metro manila and influenced by Tagalog hence the use of "Si"... followed by "din"! You sound like a Tsinoy!!!
It feels right to talk this way!BTW do Zamboanga Tsinoys ever hang out in random places in Zamboanga? Or are they usually in private settings? I guess this question goes for all of Phils. I wouldn't mind meeting some people that talk like this!
Re: Hoklo on Luzon (Philippines Hokkien), reports from the f
I did, thanks. Taking my time to slowly soak it in.amhoanna wrote:
BTW has everybody who asked to hear the Ong Le files gotten a link in their email?
