Where are the Teochews?

Discussions on the Hokkien (Minnan) language.
Lim Eng Di

Where are the Teochews?

Post by Lim Eng Di »

I'm doing a feature on where Teochiu people have settled. It will be a feature on my Teochiu-themed website (see travel section):

http://teochiu.tripod.com

If anyone is familiar with a city/town/state in any country that has a significant population of teochiu people (outside of Chaoshan), please tell me. Some examples are: Pontianak, Indonesia; Philadelphia, US; Paris, France. Information/Photos would be appreciated.

Gamsia!
Ty Lim

PC

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by PC »

Other than Ciao Zhou, Guang Dong (Teochiu, Gendang), significant population of Teochiu people is located in SE Asian countries such as Thailand Malaysia, and Vietnam. Thailand, especially, has a significant number of Teochiu people. There are also Teochiu people in Hong Kong and Taiwan due to the Chinese Civil War. In the U.S., I believe there are some Teochiu communities in California and New York. (Note: the information provided are based on my own observations, may be inaccurate.)

Na Ren

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Na Ren »

South East Asia, excluding Viet Nam (mainly Cantonese), Malaysia (with many Cantonese and Hokkien) and Indonesia, the majority Chinese population is Teochew, although in most places there has been a lot of assimilation and intermarriage. Thailand's Yawalaj district, the gold shop area of Bangkok, is an almost exclusively Teochew area. Laos has few Chinese, but most are Teochew. Cambodia has a few Teochew in the cities, but the mixed Cambodian-Teochew people still follow some Chinese practices lost in Thailand's halfbreed populations.

Ken

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Ken »

Hi Na Ren,

Is it true that the majority of the Chinese popualtion in Indonesia are Teochews? I have some reservations abt that. I think the Hokkiens are just as numerous if not more than the Teochews.

Ong

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Ong »

Hi Na Ren,

According to reliable sources, Hokkiens constitute the largest Chinese community in South-east Asia, being most numerous in Singapore, Malaysia, Philippines, Brunei and even Indonesia. Please check your facts.

Ken

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Ken »

Hi Ong,

You are absolutely right. A good reference to the distribution of Chinese dialect groups around the world is the 'Encyclopedia of Chinese Overseas' published in Singapore.

Lim Eng Di

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Lim Eng Di »

Does anyone who in which particular cities there are large concentrations of Teochiu. For Example: Riau in Indonesia, Kuching (Sarwak) Malaysia, etc. I'm wondering in which cities in particular. Also, not necessarily in SEAsia.

Thanks

Na Ren

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Na Ren »

Sorry about that confusion. I was referring to mainland Southeast Asia minus Viet Nam, Malaysia, and the island groups. Does any one know the status of Myanmar's (Burma's) Chinese population? Which dialect they belong to?

Kobo-Daishi

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Kobo-Daishi »

Dear all,

This passage comes from "Chinese" by Professor Jerry Norman published by the Cambridge University Press:

"In Southeast Asia, dialects of the Xiamen type (so-called "Hokkien" dialects) predominate, except in Thailand, where Chaozhou-speakers form the majority. Smaller communities of Fuzhou, Putian and Hainan dialect speakers are also to be found, especially in Malaysia."

"Chaozhou" is the Mandarin pronunciation for "Teochew".

Kobo-Daishi, PLLA.

P. S. In my Taishanese dialect we would pronounce it Chiao jiu.

Kobo-Daishi

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Kobo-Daishi »

Dear all,

I find that a lot of the ethnic Chinese from Vietnam living here in the United States are actually Chaozhou people but they speak Cantonese so people assume they are Cantonese.

I asked a woman and she said that Chinese schools in Vietnam offered either Cantonese or Mandarin so that is why.

Kobo-Daishi, PLLA.

P. S. Quite a few of the Chinese from Vietnam that I have met speak a dialect from Hainan Island.

P. P. S. In my last post I wrote the Taishanese pronunciation for Chaozhou. The ch- initial is pronounced like the ch- initial in pinyin Mandarin romanisation not Wade-Giles Mandarin romanisation.

xxxx

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by xxxx »

what Kobo-Daishi said is true;(many cantonese speaking pple in US are actually teochews) i won't say majority, just many

i believe many of these pple actually came from as Vietnam or Cambodia as refugees originaly... and they won't normally speak to other pple in Teochew except among themselves. In fact this is the case for Australia as well

Bamboo Shoot

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Bamboo Shoot »

Author: Na Ren (---.res.umass.edu)
Date: 03-09-03 20:30

Does any one know the status of Myanmar's (Burma's) Chinese population? Which dialect they belong to?

-------------------------

Based on my personal interviews with people I've helped or went to school with:

In Rangoon, the Chinese there is nearly half Taishanese & half Fujianese with a slight majority tilt leaning towards Fujianren. Intermarriage among the two groups is quite common and Mandarin is used between these two groups. There is no discrimination against Chinese in Burma compared to Huaren in Indonesia, Malaysia, Vietnam, and Kampuchea under the Khmer Rouge. And unlike Thailand, Chinese in Burma are not pressured to assimilate since Burma is not a homogenus society both in language & in culture compared to Thailand.

In fact, one of my cousins is dating a Fujianese from Rangoon and their common language is Mandarin.

There are also small Sichuanese populations scattered throughout Burma speaking Sichuan Mandarin.

I wouldn't be surprised if AngSang SuChee has Chinese paternal ancestry.
Her father really looks Chinese to me and I'm guessing that her surname "Ang Sang" may be transliterated from "Mr. Ong, Hong or Wong". (Someone correct me if I'm wrong).

Bamboo Shoot

Kobo-Daishi

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Kobo-Daishi »

Dear Bamboo Shoot,

You're right about the Taishanese in Myanmar (Burma).

At my work there are about 5 or 6 people from Myanmar and they all claim descent from Taishanese. Even my mother's doctor in Los Angeles' Chinatown is a Taishanese doctor from Myanmar.

I tested the Taishanese of some of my co-workers and their pronunciation for some words were so like the Cantonese pronunciation that I thought that they might as well be speaking Cantonese. That was until I later learned that there were three varieties of Taishanese and I guess some of the varieties pronounce some words more like Cantonese.

The only people that speak Hokkien dialects at my work are people from the Philippines or Taiwan. While the people from Vietnam speak either Chaozhou or Hainan Island dialects.

Kobo-Daishi, PLLA.

Lim Eng Di

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by Lim Eng Di »

"In fact, one of my cousins is dating a Fujianese from Rangoon and their common language is Mandarin."

Hmmm, I wonder why people don't learn each other's dialects and would rather resort to using mandarin. I think this happens a lot whenever chinese of differing dialect types marry. I think the less popular your dialect is, the more likely you are to learn the more prestige varieties like Mandarin, and sometimes Cantonese.

Sigh.

minnan ren

Re: Where are the Teochews?

Post by minnan ren »

Hi there.... There are many Teochew in Penang and Kedah. Most of the Teochew are concentrated at the Butterworth, Bukit Mertajam, Jawi and Nibong Tebal Regions.

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