Off topic question?

Discussions on the Cantonese language.

Tangent..pls reply

Post by K »

dear all...
what is the word in both vietnamese as well as cantonese for "AUTUMN" and "WINTER"...
Much Obliged..


Re: how do u write in chinese

Post by lily »

I dont kno how im trying to find out but there are no websites to help me
if you find any let me know ok? thanks!


Re: Off topic question?

Post by qrasy »

Dragon, I think, is a symbol of Chinese. It comes from the "unification" of some fair Mongoloid tribes, who had their own

totem (ox, bird, snake etc.). You can see that this "oriental dragon" has parts of many animals.


By the age of Huang Di (I don't know the timeline, may be it is around 3000 BC), Hua-Xia were formed. The use of "Han"

referring to Chinese came about much later, in the 3rd century BC.
12,000 B.C. is a strange time for Vietnamese. I think BaiYue either had not reached there or had not been formed. So the

civilization here could be the ancestor of "Khmers" and/or "Malays".
I think Van Lang was formed at about 5th century BC.
YeLang: Ye=Night, Lang=Man, this means "Night Men", a strange meaning. I think this could be a Chinese pronunciation

of "Yerong" (Yerong is a name of a Daic Language found in southern China.)
Phung Nguyen or Dong Son civilization may not be the ancestors of modern Vietnamese.
Also, I would like to know how does the 22-characters "worm-script" look like if you have the images.
About the Chinese words in Vietnamese, the Middle-Chinese ones ("Sino-Vietnamese") are certainly fake since

Vietnamese has existed long before the "Middle-Age" of Chinese, though some Vietnamese words are replaced with this.
Spring: Xuõn; Summer: Hạ; Autumn: Thu; Winter: éụng; Study: Học

Sino-Xenic (Sino-Jp, Sino-Kor, Sino-Viet) words are just loanwords from China.
Mandarin is not north barbarians' languages "Altaic" but a form of Chinese influenced by them (Loss of -p, -t, -k, -m, etc.)

HKB gave some wrong points.
School "Xue-Xiao", the "Xue" should have "H-" instead of "X-" and "-K" ending, and "Xiao", the "X-" is somekind of voiced

"H-", which becomes "G-" in Japanese. Ki/Ji, Hi/Xi, Khi/Qi has already merged in Mandarin.
>Japanese should be Gaku-Sei (Remember, Japanese do not have -k, so it becomes -ku)
Glass "an-gang" Cantonese, here I think ng- is missing from "eye". It could be only a dialectical variance from "ngan" (the

Cantonese found here)
>Sino-Japanese is "koku" not "goku".
Sometimes Japanese voice the initial of a word if combined with others.
"Chuu" +"koku"--> "Chuugoku", "San"+"Sen"--> "Sanzen"
The native word for "Country" is "Kuni"
> "gim" vietnamese --> Ki{e^̣ }m (Mid.Chn.), G{u'}{o'}m (Probably Old C.)
Modern Number of Vietnamese come not from Sinitic, perhaps it's from Tibeto-Burman.
I believe that "Việt" means "Axe".
Referring to:
the pictogram of "Viet" are simply Axe.

In Fact, there is a word "Yue" that means axe, written with "metal" as signify and "Yue" (The same phonetic as Yue

"Pass") as phonetic.
| ã.
------------------- --------------|---
| |
_ _ | .ạ̃
_....--ã**Ằ | .ạ̃
|..ạ̃ .ạ̃

| ã.
---------------- |ẰẰẰẰẰẰẰẰ|ẰẰ
_ _ | .ạ̃
_....--ãã"Ằ | .ạ̃
|.ạ̃ .ạ̃
(I tried to draw the axes as well as I could. I hope these would look like what I mean)


Re: Off topic question?

Post by qrasy »

For School Japanese uses gaku-en instead, gaku=learn (xue), en=garden (yuan)



Post by Xarzy »

Well, this is a dead topic. Where is Hung Dao Dai Vuong?


Re: Off topic question?

Post by Amego »

abc123 wrote:ya.. why did the japs take our chinese characters and added their hiragana and katakana?... japs were probably once chinese..
uh..japanese?? ew..

neway, aren't we all the same ppl.....
Erm...this is a common misconception....well the following except e 1st paragraph, is written by me in another thread....i lazy i lifted e entire thingy....

Hello everyone,
I think that Cantonese originally weren't Chinese.
"Why?" you might ask. Well, for starters, if you look at the maps of ancient China, the Cantonese regions weren't even taken over until the Qin dynasty. Plus, look at the similarity between the way we (the Cantonese) say "yes" compared to the Japanese.
What do you think?

ok firstly e word "hai" in Cantonese is from the word 係 and has nothing to do with e Japanese "hai"...its pure coincidence...

and there is a common misconception...Japanese is one languange that is "not related to any other languages in the world" (quoted from 1 site)
unlike Chinese "which has tonnes of sister languages".

Japanese began speaking Japanese long before Chinese noticed their prescence...but there was one problem...Japanese spoke only...they din write...WHY? Because they don have a writing system!!!! A bit lame right?

Therefore the Japanese realised that they need to write...and they borrowed thousands of words from Chinese...sharing some pronounciations...BUT in terms of phoenetics, sentence structures, tenses n so on , we can see that its extremely unique n different from Chinese...

Therefore it is important to realise that Japanese existed for thousands of years before e borrowing of Chinese charactors to WRITE...n note that those wormy (hiragana) & angular (katakana) characters used in japanese originated from Chinese characters too!!!!

jus a little example to illustrate my point...ok

before Chinese arrived...Japanese called a tree "ki"

den the Chinese arrived...a tree is still called "ki" BUT it has been assigned a character "木".

but e Japanese decided that they needed another pronounciation for e Chinese derived word "木"...perhaps they wanted to acknowledge the Chinese for their effort....or to expand they vocab or for other thingy...

so they have a Sino-Japanese pronounciation for "木" (muk6) which is boku...hahah i sounds like hokkien...but its juz coincidence...bear with me...

木----ki (kun-reading) (common)
boku (on-reading) (only used with some borrowed words)

so in everyday Japanese life, when a kid sees a tree he exclaims to his parents,

"ki da!" but not
"boku da!"

"This is a tree!"

"Li6 por2 hai6 xu6!"

In a nutshell, Japanese has no cousins. =p

So...yeppy...hope u all can gain some insights =)


Post by Guest »

Don't argue for the non-sense. The Bai-Yue existed around the Yangtze River for a long time before the coming of the Han (Huang He River). Cantonese and Vietnamese were the parallel line of descendents from the Bai-Yue. At the time of Lac Long Quan, Lac Viet included the Cantonese and Vietnamese people at that time. The Chinese that they are speaking today is the Mandarin from the North, not the South. Most of the Chinese culture and great economic performance came from the South China, not the North. It's not unusual to believe that South Chinese culture and Vietnamese share similarities. Some day, I will get it back. Don't be bowed to the Northern Chinese if you are the Cantonese. YOu have to fight what you stand for


Post by Guest »

Autumn=Thu = Cau
Winer = Dong = Doong


Post by qrasy »

?----ki (kun-reading) (common)
boku (on-reading) (only used with some borrowed words)
also read 'moku'