Ku Ka Pih

Discussions on the Hokkien (Minnan) language.
SimL
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Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 8:33 am
Location: Amsterdam

Ku Ka Pih

Post by SimL »

I started this topic for questions on the wide range of nonsense verse with the line "龜咬鱉" ("Ku Ka Pih") in them.

1. Does anyone know the meaning of "sat bu". I'm told it is a "flea". I didn't know this word from my youth, only "bat sat", which is a "bedbug".

2. Could anyone give the hanzi for both "sat bu" and "bat sat". One of my friends gave me "跳蚤" but I believe this is more just borrowing the characters used for the Mandarin word of the same meaning.

In the stories which my parents tell of their childhood, bedbugs were always present, until around after the war, when (I believe) DDT got rid of them very easily.

3. In my mother's version of the poem, the line "khoo-kau ka tiunn-lang" (<?> 狗咬丈人) occurs. My mother tells me that "khoo" means "to ask", "to order", "to instruct", as in, one asks the dog to bite the 丈人. Does anyone know the hanzi for "khoo". I suppose the non-sandhi tone might be "khoo2", because in the poem, I say "khoo1 kau2".

Thanks,
Sim.
SimL
Posts: 1407
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 8:33 am
Location: Amsterdam

Ku Ka Pih

Post by SimL »

In both the "Suat Mui" and the "Ku Ka Pih", the word "針黹" (embroidery) occurs. The first character is of course pronounced "ciam1", but I can't find a pronunciation for 黹.

Does anyone know?

Thanks,
Sim.
niuc
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Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 3:23 pm
Location: Singapore

Post by niuc »

Sim, I don't know about the poem but it sounds interesting. Could you post the entire text here?

Flea is 虱母 sat4-bu2 ("flea-mother"). Bedbug is 木虱 bak7-sat4 ("wood-flea"). The latter was borrowed into Malay/Indonesian as "bangsat" to mean "bedbug" or "a jerk or scoundrel". I don't know about "khoo2" in the context.
ong
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 6:04 am

Post by ong »

It is ci2
ong
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 6:04 am

Post by ong »

It is 呼。This is 上古音。
SimL
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Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 8:33 am
Location: Amsterdam

Post by SimL »

Does anyone know what a "田葛蛤" (chan kua-kap) is?

It appears to be a type of frog, but does anyone have any more details?

Thanks,
Sim.

P.S. Niuc: I'll post one version of this poem tomorrow.
SimL
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Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 8:33 am
Location: Amsterdam

Post by SimL »

niuc wrote:Sim, I don't know about the poem but it sounds interesting. Could you post the entire text here?

Flea is 虱母 sat4-bu2 ("flea-mother"). Bedbug is 木虱 bak7-sat4 ("wood-flea"). The latter was borrowed into Malay/Indonesian as "bangsat" to mean "bedbug" or "a jerk or scoundrel". I don't know about "khoo2" in the context.
Hi Niuc,

After I saw your reply, I realised that we had talked about insects and other "creepy crawlies" a few years ago. I did a search and found viewtopic.php?t=2091&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=45. To my relief, I see that you posted the hanzi for "bedbug" but not for "flea". Otherwise I would have been embarassed about asking the same question again, 1-2 years after originally asking it!

I guess I should do a search in the Forum if I think someone has once posted some information on an area I'm interested in.

Sim
SimL
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Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 8:33 am
Location: Amsterdam

My mother's version

Post by SimL »

Thanks Niuc and Ong!

Sim.

---

Niuc, below I've posted the poem the way it was learnt by my mother as a young girl, along with my attempted "translation". All you people with a better knowledge of Hokkien, please correct any mistakes I've made in translation!

Putting "龜咬鱉" into a search-engine gives 10+ hits. Here are four different ones I've found (sometimes they are at the middle or end of a very long page, so do a 'find' for "龜咬鱉" on the page if you don't see it at the start).

1. http://content.edu.tw/local/taichun/yua ... es/071.htm
2. http://blog.yam.com/limkianhui/archives/1381494.html
3. http://163.26.172.1/~twese/song.htm
4. http://www.edutech.org.tw/Traditional/% ... %AC%A0.htm

As you can see, they are all *very* different from one another (and from my mother's version), as you might expect for this sort of "nonsense poem". I've started looking at the first two, and will later post any other questions I have about them here.

My mother's version:
-------------------------

荔枝树尾(要? )红, 呼狗咬丈人
lai-ci chiu-be ang, khoo-kau ka tiunn-lang
The tips of the lychee tree are red. Urge the dog to bite the father-in-law.

丈人走去避, 龜咬鱉
tiunn-lang cau khy bih, ku ka pih
The uncle runs and hides. The tortoise bites the turtle.

鱉圇头, 龜咬猴
pih lun thau, ku ka kau
The turtle retracts its head. The tortoise bites the monkey.

猴(黜/落)毛, 棕沾糖
kau lut mng, cang un thng
The monkey sheds hair. The rice dumpling is dipped in sugar.

糖甜甜, 虱母叮牛奶
thng tinn-tinn, sat-bu teng gu-ni
The sugar is sweet. The flea bites the cow's udder.

[End of Poem]
niuc
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Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 3:23 pm
Location: Singapore

Post by niuc »

Sim, thanks for the poem. It's funny and interesting.

Regarding our discussion last time, actually I also don't really remember until I read those postings again.... so no worry about repetition of similar questions.

About "田葛蛤" (chan kua-kap), I'm not sure if it's the same as "田蛤仔" (chan5-kap8-a8, my common word for frog) or a specific type.

Your translation is just nice. Btw small typo: 棕 should be 粽. And according to link 2, un3 is 揾. Actually I saw a more complex character for this at Taiwanese TV comercial but I don't remember it now.
SimL
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Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 8:33 am
Location: Amsterdam

Post by SimL »

Hi Niuc,

Thanks for the feedback. For 'un' 沾 is definitely wrong. However, there is a possibility that 搵 is even better. It has the pronunciation 'un' in the internet dictionary I gave in one of the recent postings.

As for "田葛蛤", it could very well be the same as your "田蛤仔", as it is the first line of another one of the ku-ka-pih versions (the first link of the 4 I gave). It begins "田葛蛤仔官." Even here, the last character may be slightly inaccurate. One of my friends helped me to read one of the links (the second one of the 4 I gave), which explained that "倌" is a word used to 'make an animal have human characteristics', like when an animal is the hero of a folk-tale. You can find this in the footnotes, as footnote #1.

Sim.
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