Malaysian Cantonese

Discussions on the Cantonese language.
Peace of mind

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby Peace of mind » Sat Jan 08, 2005 6:24 pm

Oh AlexNg by the way, "Lui" is also used by Cantonese speakers in Cambodia even though Cantonese speakers are not the majority amongst Chinese (mostly Chao2 Zhou1) in Cambodia ! Surprise !

AlexNg

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby AlexNg » Fri Jan 14, 2005 12:51 am

I do not know how "lui" got into cambodia but it is definitely not a chinese word.

Try speaking it in china / hong kong / taiwan where they have no relatives from south east asia and they won't understand.

AlexNg

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby AlexNg » Fri Jan 14, 2005 1:04 am

The purpose of this thread is so that malaysians can recognize foreign words from hokkien and malay.

Surprisingly, malaysian hokkien don't borrow words from cantonese, it is usually the other way around.

Most people are confused which words are pure cantonese and which words are hokkien/malay. So please change your words so that cantonese all over the world can understand each other.

Nowadays, those malay educated chinese use a lot of english words (as high as 70%) because their command of the chinese language is poor.

Peace of mind

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby Peace of mind » Sat Jan 15, 2005 3:36 am

Hi AlexNg,

I already told you "lui" is NOT a Malay word ! My grandparents are from Canton China and they said "lui" when I was a little kid, every native Cantonese speakers in Vietnam say "lui" for "money" ! Are you telling me my grandparents learned that from the Malay word "duit" for "lui" !

AlexNg wrote:
>Surprisingly, malaysian hokkien don't borrow words from cantonese, it is usually the other way around

I don't know how good or bad Malaysian Cantonese' Cantonese is, but Cantonese in Vietnam do not borrow words from Hokkien. Having said that, a couple of popular words exchange between dialects is unavoidable, however, I don't mix Cantonese and Vietnamese or Mandarin in my conversation, I don't mix English in my Cantonese or vice versa !
When people mix 2 languages into one, they simply tell people that they are not good at either ones !

AlexNg

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby AlexNg » Sat Jan 15, 2005 12:29 pm

Peace of mind ,

Lui cannot be of cantonese origin because I have been watching hong kong serials for like 30+ years. And I even mixed with hong kong people for 4 years.

There is someone in the hokkien thread that says it is instead a hokkien word instead of malay word.

qrasy

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby qrasy » Sun Jan 16, 2005 11:07 am

You know that there are some dialects of Cantonese.

The Cantonese dialect found is somehow different from Hong Kong.

For Example, the numbers are:

It Ngei Sam Sei Ng Lok Thit Pat Kyu Sip

And Not:
Yat Yi Sam Sei Ng Lok Tshat Pat Kau Sap

AlexNg

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby AlexNg » Sun Jan 16, 2005 11:10 pm

Here is my updated list:

Hokkien words:
------------------

1. "Ka Ki" - should be "Ji Kei" for "ownself" as in "ngo ji kei"

2. "diam" - silent, it should be "on jing".

3. "pai" - number of times, it should be "chi"


Malay word
--------------

1. "Sinang" - twisted version of "Senang" - should be "Yung Yi"

2. "Lui" - chinese version of "Duit" for money - should be "Chin"

3. "Sama" - mispronounciation of "Semua" for all - should be "Chuin Pou"

4. "Pasak" - chinese version of malay word "pasar" for market.
The proper cantonese word for market is "Si Chap", night market is "Yeh Si".

5. "Mata" - old version of malay word "Mata- mata" for police. Should be "Chai Yan" or "King Chak".

6. "Panai" - chinese version of "Pandai" - should be "Lek" (Person) or "Hou"
(Good at doing things)

7. "Tolong" - Help - should be "Kau Kau" or "Pai Tok"


English
---------

Nowadays, those malay educated chinese use a lot of english words (as high as 70%) because their command of the chinese language is poor.

Eng Wai

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby Eng Wai » Mon Jan 17, 2005 12:29 pm

I can understand Cantonese but cannot speak it fluently. I hardly mingle with the Malaysian Cantonese, thus not being aware of the prevailing loan words in KL Cantonese.

I am interested in comparing the loan words in Malaysian Hokkien and Malaysian Cantonese to see if any trend could be observed.

"Diam" is controversial whether it is a Hokkien word or Malay word. "Lui" is disputable as well.

"Pasak" (Malay -- market) and "Mata (Malay -- Police)" are borrowed by Hokkien as well. We still overwhelmingly use Hokkien words for "easy (eng)", "all (ka liao)", "good (gau)". Occasionally "tolong (Malay -- help)" or "help" is used instead of "ta kao chiu (Hokkien)".

How do you pronounce Kangkung in Cantonese (both Malaysia and Hong Kong)???

Eng Wai

AlexNg

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby AlexNg » Tue Jan 18, 2005 2:20 am

Eng Wai,

I was born and raised in KL, so I know KL cantonese very well.

That is also to discount those "outside KL" guys who come to KL but try to speak cantonese with even more hokkien words, mainly because their cantonese is poor.

The above list is the most common loan words by people born in KL and who are fluent in cantonese in the first place.

The purpose of this thread is to educate people to stop using the loan words as most of them do not know that they are loan words in the first place.

Eng Wai

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby Eng Wai » Tue Jan 18, 2005 10:21 am

How do you say Kangkung in cantonese?

Eng Wai

AlexNg

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby AlexNg » Wed Jan 19, 2005 1:44 pm

I don't know how kangkung is pronounced as I am not an expert in vegetables. Is it "Yung Choi" ? What is the mandarin version?

I think kangkung is a malaysian vegetable ?

Anyway, it doesn't matter because we can safely used malay words for local vegetables.

Eng Wai

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby Eng Wai » Wed Jan 19, 2005 5:10 pm

Well, every vegetable that grows in Malaysia is local vegetable :)

As you can read from the Hokkien forum, the origin of the word "Kangkung" is now suspected to be of Chinese origin. From Hokkien language point of view, this suggestion is feasible. However, if cantonese (China & Malaysia) vocabulary for Kangkung is similar to Kangkung, this issue can then be solved.

The mandarin name for this vegetable is 空心菜 or 蕹菜。Could anyone from Hong Kong, Vietnam or wherever confirm with us the Cantonese term for this vege?

Eng Wai

AlexNg

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby AlexNg » Fri Jan 21, 2005 2:20 am

Here is the update list again as I missed out one very common mispronounciation borrowed from hokkien:

Hokkien words:
------------------

1. "Ka Ki" - should be "Ji Kei" for "ownself" as in "ngo ji kei"

2. "diam" - silent, it should be "on jing".

3. "pai" - number of times, it should be "chi"

4. "sien" - meaning "bored", it should be "moon"


Malay word
--------------

1. "Sinang" - twisted version of "Senang" - should be "Yung Yi"

2. "Lui" - chinese version of "Duit" for money - should be "Chin"

3. "Sama" - mispronounciation of "Semua" for all - should be "Chuin Pou"

4. "Pasak" - chinese version of malay word "pasar" for market.
The proper cantonese word for market is "Si Chap", night market is "Yeh Si".

5. "Mata" - old version of malay word "Mata- mata" for police. Should be "Chai Yan" or "King Chak".

6. "Panai" - chinese version of "Pandai" - should be "Lek" (Person) or "Hou"
(Good at doing things)

7. "Tolong" - Help - should be "Kau Kau" or "Pai Tok"


English
---------

Nowadays, those malay educated chinese use a lot of english words (as high as 70%) because their command of the chinese language is poor.

Leslie Chong

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby Leslie Chong » Sat Jan 22, 2005 1:41 am

The Cantonese in Sandakan call it "vung choi" sounding like "ung choi" (u like a double-o "-oo-"). A Cantonese cook from Vietnam understood this when I used it. I think Hong Kong Cantonese call it "tung choi".

Peace of mind

Re: Malaysian Cantonese

Postby Peace of mind » Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:46 pm

"ung choi" (Vietnam)
"tong choi通菜" (Hong Kong)


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