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	<title>Chinese languages</title>
	<subtitle>Chinese languages</subtitle>
	<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/index.php" />
	<updated>2003-05-03T23:20:28+00:00</updated>

	<author><name><![CDATA[Chinese languages]]></name></author>
	<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/app.php/feed/topic/132</id>

		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-05-03T23:20:28+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-05-03T23:20:28+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=564#p564</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=564#p564"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
		<content type="html" xml:base="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=564#p564"><![CDATA[
"ngok sai" jiushi "ba4dao4" de yisi.<p>Statistics: Posted by Guest — Sat May 03, 2003 11:20 pm</p><hr />
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	</entry>
		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-05-03T18:52:14+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-05-03T18:52:14+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=563#p563</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=563#p563"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
		<content type="html" xml:base="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=563#p563"><![CDATA[
Hi Lisa,<br><br>The wife and I are fine, but we're still trying.<br><br>With regard to the ng- initial, it seems to be a modern innovation. One needs to back to see the old dictionaries of Cantonese first, and we find that many modern ng- words were not once ng- initialed words, and that certain modern syllables beginning with a vowel in fact began with ng. This mixup may be driven by Hong Kong speech of late. To lend support to this, you need only need view old films from the 50's and 60's and you will see that Cantonese of that era and perhaps people who can remember those eras speak differently to younger folk.<br><br>For instance  the following <br><br>English Modern  1950's<br>outside oi      ngoi<br>love    ngoi    oi<br>house   nguk    uk<br><br><br>Dyl.<p>Statistics: Posted by Guest — Sat May 03, 2003 6:52 pm</p><hr />
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	</entry>
		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-05-03T13:45:19+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-05-03T13:45:19+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=562#p562</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=562#p562"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
		<content type="html" xml:base="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=562#p562"><![CDATA[
&gt; I think actually the "proper" pronounciation would be "ngok" and that <br>&gt; due to changes it's become "ok" sort of like "ngow" (cow or beef)<br>&gt; became "ow". Very Hong Kong. I don't notice it in other Cantonese<br>&gt; speakers.<br><br>I suspect it is the other way around. In Malaysian Cantonese, words like 牛 and 噩 keep their /ng-/ initial, but 惡 is one of the few words that are pronounced /ok/ without /ng-/.<br><br>Sebastian.<p>Statistics: Posted by Guest — Sat May 03, 2003 1:45 pm</p><hr />
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	</entry>
		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-05-02T22:58:53+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-05-02T22:58:53+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=561#p561</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=561#p561"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
		<content type="html" xml:base="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=561#p561"><![CDATA[
Hi Dylan!<br><br>How're the newlyweds?  Any little Sungs coming along?<br><br>I think actually the "proper" pronounciation would be "ngok" and that due to changes it's become "ok" sort of like "ngow"  (cow or beef) became "ow".  Very Hong Kong.  I don't notice it in other Cantonese speakers.<br><br>Lisa<p>Statistics: Posted by Guest — Fri May 02, 2003 10:58 pm</p><hr />
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	</entry>
		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-05-02T11:36:13+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-05-02T11:36:13+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=560#p560</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=560#p560"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
		<content type="html" xml:base="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=560#p560"><![CDATA[
It could be that due to sound changes that ok sai has become ngok sai.<br><br>ok means to be fierce<br>sai means all, everything<br><br>Therefore, it refers to someone's fierce demeanour and this person is trying to use ferocity to win an argument.<br><br>Basically it is rhetorical, "nei ok sai ya?" basically, means "do you think that by your ferocity that you win?" or something to that effect.<br><br>Dyl.<p>Statistics: Posted by Guest — Fri May 02, 2003 11:36 am</p><hr />
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	</entry>
		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Sally]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-05-02T10:55:26+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-05-02T10:55:26+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=559#p559</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=559#p559"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
		<content type="html" xml:base="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=559#p559"><![CDATA[
Well,I am sorry to say that I have never heard this saying,though having lived in Canton all my life!<br>Do you think you have jotted down the wrong one?<p>Statistics: Posted by <a href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&amp;u=304">Sally</a> — Fri May 02, 2003 10:55 am</p><hr />
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	</entry>
		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-05-01T14:56:51+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-05-01T14:56:51+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=558#p558</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=558#p558"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[Re: meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
		<content type="html" xml:base="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=558#p558"><![CDATA[
What is the context?<br><br>[%sig%]<p>Statistics: Posted by Guest — Thu May 01, 2003 2:56 pm</p><hr />
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	</entry>
		<entry>
		<author><name><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></name></author>
		<updated>2003-04-30T19:58:56+00:00</updated>

		<published>2003-04-30T19:58:56+00:00</published>
		<id>http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=557#p557</id>
		<link href="http://chineselanguage.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=557#p557"/>
		<title type="html"><![CDATA[meaning of "ngok sai"?]]></title>

		
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Hi, anyone know the meaning of "ngok sai"?  If anyone does it would be great.  Thanks! Cheers, Steve.<p>Statistics: Posted by Guest — Wed Apr 30, 2003 7:58 pm</p><hr />
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